Death

<body topmargin=0 leftmargin=0 marginheight=0 marginwidth=0> <table cellpadding=0 cellspacing=0 border=0><tr> <td valign="top" colspan=2 height=110 BGCOLOR="#FFFFFF" TEXT="#080000" bgproperties="fixed" background="084f0f21egerdp.jpg"> <div> <FONT SIZE="1" COLOR="#66334C" FACE="Arial" ><B><IMG SRC="042203c0.jpg" border=0 width="32" height="60" ALIGN="BOTTOM" HSPACE="0" VSPACE="0"></B></FONT><FONT SIZE="5" COLOR="#66334C" FACE="Arial" ><B>Crossbearer.net</B></FONT><FONT SIZE="1" COLOR="#66334C" FACE="Arial" ><B>      | </B></FONT><B>    </B><A HREF="index.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Crossbearer.net"><U><B>home</B></U></A><B>   </B><B> </B><A HREF="id226.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Armageddon"><U>Armageddon</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id223.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Blood"><U>Blood</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id212.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Cross"><U>Cross</U></A>   |   <B>Death</B>   |   <A HREF="id224.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Earth "><U>Earth </U></A>   |   <A HREF="id225.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Heaven"><U>Heaven</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id222.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Interfaith"><U>Interfaith</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id214.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Jehovah God"><U>Jehovah God</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id219.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Jehovahs Witness"><U>Jehovah's Witness</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id220.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Lords Meal"><U>Lord's Meal</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id221.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Return of Christ"><U>Return of Christ</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id216.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Salvation"><U>Salvation</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id217.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Eternal Life"><U>Eternal Life</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id218.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Trinity"><U>Trinity</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id237.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="John 1:1 What do scholars say?"><U>John 1:1  What do scholars say?</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id238.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Where are the Dead?"><U>Where are the Dead?</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id245.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Wisdom"><U>Wisdom</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id254.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Former J.Ws."><U>Former J.W's.</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id293.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Subliminal Images"><U>Subliminal Images</U></A></div> <div>                                                         Return to <A HREF="id56.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="JW doctrines"><U>J.W. Doctrines</U></A></div> <div> </div> </td> </tr><tr> <td valign="top" width=210 BGCOLOR="#FFFFFF" TEXT="#080000" bgproperties="fixed" background="083f2f02egerdp.jpg"> <div>  <IMG SRC="http://members.tripod.com/bin/counter/id213.htm?FF0000" ALT="[Tripod Counter]">  </div> <div> Write me: <A HREF="id18.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Contact Me"><U>e-mail</U></A></div> <div> <A HREF="id205.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Jehovahs Witnesses"><U>Home JW page</U></A><FONT SIZE="2" COLOR="#66334C" FACE="Arial" > </FONT></div> <div> Return to <A HREF="id19.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Studies on Cults and Religions"><U>Studies on Cults and Religions</U></A></div> <bR> <div> <A HREF="http://www.biblegateway.com/" TARGET="_top" TITLE="http://www.biblegateway.com/"><U>Bible search</U></A><FONT SIZE="2" COLOR="#66334C" FACE="Arial" > click here to find a Bible verse. (open in New Window to retain this web page)</FONT></div> <bR> <div> Comprehesive study on <FONT SIZE="2" COLOR="#000099" FACE="Arial" ><A HREF="id238.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Where are the Dead?"><U>Where are the dead</U></A></FONT>!</div> <bR> <div> Study on the deity of <A HREF="id215.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Jesus"><U>Jesus Christ</U></A></div> <bR> <div> For a complete review of the J.W. cult by a former J.W., go to Erich Grieshaber's <A HREF="http://www.blueletterbible.org/study/cults/exposejw/" TARGET="_top" TITLE="http://www.blueletterbible.org/study/cul"><U>Expose of Jehovah's Witnesses</U></A></div> </td> <td valign="top" height=370 BGCOLOR="#FFFFFF" TEXT="#080000" bgproperties="fixed" background="086f0f03.jpg"> <div> <I>Death</I></div> <bR> <div> Condition of the dead (the BTD says <FONT SIZE="3" COLOR="#800080" FACE="Arial" >body and soul are the same</FONT>) They define the soul as a body that is alive. So when the body dies, the soul “knows nothing”, it disappears and is sleeping until the resurrection. This doctrine was adopted from the <B>7</B><FONT SIZE="1" COLOR="#000000" FACE="Arial" ><B>th</B></FONT><B> Day Adventists</B>, through which the JW's can give credit for their birth in 1884 by Charles T. Russell who studied with the SDA's.  Both groups, <B>the SDA's and the JW's were birthed by false prophecies of the coming of Jesus Christ</B>! Both failed to see the return of Christ on the day they prophetically claimed that Jesus would return. That is why the JW's have resorted to a doctrine of a “Spirit” return of Christ in 1914 which is one of their failed prophetic dates of Christ's physical return. </div> <bR> <div> You can review this on the web page <FONT SIZE="3" COLOR="#0000FF" FACE="Arial" ><A HREF="id173.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Watchtower False Prophecies"><U>Watchtower False Prophecies</U></A></FONT>.</div> <bR> <div> But the soul and body are NOT the same and scripture shows that the soul has a conscience awareness after death. </div> <bR> <div> <U>1 Kings 17:22</U>   EIijah prays for the soul of the child to return to his body <I>"Jehovah my God please, cause </I><I><B>the </B></I><I><B><U>soul</U></B></I><I><B> of this child to come back within him</B></I><I>”.</I></div> <bR> <div> <U>1 Thess 4:14</U> "<I><B>God will bring WITH Him those who sleep</B></I><I>"</I> to be resurrected with their physical body in v. 16.  If their body is in the grave, HOW can God (Jesus) bring them WITH Him when He returns from heaven?</div> <bR> <div> <U>1Thess 5:23</U> Says we have a "<I><B><U>Spirit, soul and body</U></B></I>."</div> <bR> <div> And when the body dies the soul may still live.</div> <bR> <div> <U>Rev. 6:9-10</U> The souls of dead saints crying out to God for vengeance </div> <bR> <div> Rev. 6:9-10 </div> <div>     <I>And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar </I><I><B><U>the souls of them that were slain</U></B></I><I> for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: [10] </I><I><B><U>And they cried with a loud voice, saying, </U></B></I><I>How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? </I></div> <bR> <div> <U>Matt</U> <U>10:28</U>  “<I>do not fear those who kill the </I><I><B><U>body but cannot kill the soul</U></B></I><I>; rather fear Him that can </I><I><B><U>destroy both soul and body</U></B></I>."</div> <bR> <div> Jesus clearly identifies that the body and soul are separate in the above scripture!</div> <bR> <div> <B><U>The "BTD” says the </U></B><FONT SIZE="3" COLOR="#800080" FACE="Arial" ><B><U>"Dead are unconscience, know nothing</U></B></FONT><B><U>. ”BUT, the scriptures show that the dead are conscience.</U></B></div> <bR> <div> <U>Jonah 2:2</U>  “...<I>out of the belly of </I><I><B><U>She'ol I</U></B></I><I><U> </U></I><I><B><U>cried</U></B></I><I> for help. You heard my voice.”</I></div> <bR> <div>      <U>Rev. 6:9-l 0</U>   “...<I>the souls of those slaughtered because of the word of God ...they </I><I><B><U>cried with a loud voice</U></B></I><I>, saying Until when...and avenging our blood ...”  </I>(see your Bible for the complete verses)</div> <bR> <div> <U>Matt 25:46</U> The wicked are judged and then .." <I>these will depart </I><I><B>into everlasting </B></I><I><B><U>punishment</U></B></I><I>  (Gr. Kolasis -</I>means infliction, punishment, torment), <I>but the righteous ones into everlasting Life" </I>Everlasting means- without end.</div> <bR> <div> The dead are NOT asleep awaiting resurrection</div> <bR> <div> <U>l Ptr. 3:19-20 & 4:5-6</U>   The dead in prison hear the gospel so they may be judged</div> <bR> <div> <U>John 11:11-14, 23-26</U>  speaks of Lazarus sleeping meaning he was dead but yet in <U>Luke 16:20-31</U> we see Lazarus very much aware of his surroundings in Abraham's Bosom and the Rich man is very much aware of his torment (verse 23). <B>Abraham himself</B> is very much aware of the situation and speaks even though he died thousands of years before.</div> <bR> <div> ( Although nowhere does this scripture say that this is a parable, <B>Jesus does not lie</B>. If this is a parable, then it is still TRUE. If this was only a parable, then this is the only parable in which a man was named, Lazarus, and still fit the exact occurrence of what really happened. </div> <div> And again, the <B><U>main theme</U></B> of this story was the fact that Hades was a  <I>“</I><I><B><U>place of torment</U></B></I><I>” </I>and the rich man pleaded for Lazarus to return and to <U>WARN his brothers</U>  “..<I><B><U>lest</U></B></I><B><U> </U></B><I><B><U>they also come to this place of torment</U></B></I><I> </I>(Luke 16:28) Please be wise when you consider this scripture and don't explain it away. This scripture clearly says that Hades <U>is a place of </U><B><U>conscious torment</U></B>. To deny the torments of hell, is to call Jesus a liar!</div> <bR> <div> <U>Rev. 14:9-11</U> speaks of these who had received the Mark of the beast and says <I>"and the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever; </I><I><B><U>and they have NO REST day or night</U></B></I><I>.."   </I>"No Rest" means No Sleep</div> <bR> <div> In  <U>Deut. 34:5-6</U> Moses Dies but in <U>Matt. 17:3</U> <B>Moses appears and is talking to Jesus</B>. Was Moses talking in his sleep? Even the apostles saw him (Verse 1-3)</div> <bR> <div> <B><U>The BTD also declares C. </U></B><FONT SIZE="3" COLOR="#990080" FACE="Arial" ><B><U>Talking with the dead impossible</U></B></FONT></div> <div> It's not impossible, but it is an abomination (1Sam. Ch. 28 & Deut. 18:11-12)</div> <bR> <div> <B><U>The "BTD” says </U></B><FONT SIZE="3" COLOR="#800080" FACE="Arial" ><B><U>"The dead not alive with God as spirits".</U></B></FONT></div> <div> Maybe not as spirits but their souls are alive with God:</div> <div> We read in <U>Rev. 6:9-11</U> the “souls" of the righteous dead crying out to God for vengeance.</div> <bR> <div> In <U>Rev. 7:9-15</U> the righteous are standing before the <B>THRONE  OF GOD</B>, dressed in white. (In the body, soul or spirit do you suppose they stand before God.) Where is the THRONE or GOD? Heaven? or Earth?</div> <bR> <bR> <bR> <div> <B>Current Day "Sadducees"</B><FONT SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000" FACE="Arial" >    It is interesting to note that the JW doctrine of the "non-existance" of the soul after death, is a return to the doctrine of the Sadducees! </FONT></div> <bR> <div> <FONT SIZE="2" COLOR="#800000" FACE="Georgia" ><B>Act 23:6-8</B></FONT>  <I>But when Paul perceived that the one part were Sadducees, and the other Pharisees, he cried out in the council, Men </I><FONT SIZE="2" COLOR="#808080" FACE="Georgia" ><I>and</I></FONT><I> brethren, I am a Pharisee, the son of a Pharisee: of the hope and resurrection of the dead I am called in question. And when he had so said, there arose a dissension between the Pharisees and the Sadducees: and the multitude was divided. For the Sadducees say that there is no resurrection, neither angel, nor spirit: but the Pharisees confess both.</I> </div> <bR> <div> <B>The following are writings from scholars Albert Barnes and Dr. John Gill.</B></div> <bR> <div> <B>Act 23:8</B> - </div> <div> <B>For the </B><FONT SIZE="2" COLOR="#0000FF" FACE="Georgia" ><A HREF="http://mb-soft.com/believe/txo/sadducee.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="http://mb-soft.com/believe/txo/sadducee."><U>Sadducees</U></A></FONT><B> say - </B>They believe.</div> <div> <B>No resurrection - </B>Of the dead. By this doctrine they also understood that there was no future state, and that the soul did not exist after death. See the notes on <FONT SIZE="2" COLOR="#008000" FACE="Georgia" ><U>Mat_22:23</U></FONT>.</div> <div> <B>Nor spirit - </B>Nor soul. That there is nothing but matter. They were materialists, and supposed that all the operations which we ascribe to mind could be traced to some modification of matter. The Sadducees, says Josephus (<I>Jewish Wars</I>, book ii. chapter 8, section 14), “take away the belief of the immortal duration of the soul, and the punishments and rewards in Hades.” “The doctrine of the Sadducees is this,” says he (<I>Antiq.</I>, book 18, chapter 1, section 4), “that souls die with the bodies.” The opinion that the soul is material, and that there is nothing but matter in the universe, has been held by many philosophers, ancient and modern, as well as by the Sadducees.</div> <div> <B>Confess both - </B>Acknowledge, or receive both as true; that is, that there is a future state, and that there are spirits distinct from matter, as angels, and the disembodied souls of people. The two points in dispute were:</div> <div> (1)     Whether the dead would be raised and exist in a future state; and,</div> <div> (2)     Whether mind was distinct from matter. The Sadducees denied both, and the Pharisees believed both. Their belief of the Latter point was, that spirits existed in two forms - that of angels, and that of souls of people distinct from the body.</div> <bR> <div>  <FONT SIZE="1" COLOR="#000000" FACE="Georgia" ><I>Albert Barnes' Notes on the Bible   (1798-1870)</I></FONT></div> <bR> <div> ----------------------------------------------------</div> <bR> <div> <B>Acts 23:8</B></div> <div> <B>neither angel nor spirit</B>; … that they did not believe any such species of beings as angels, nor indeed any spirits whatever, which were immaterial or immortal; for as for the spirit or soul of man, they took that to be only the temperament of the body, and that it died with it, and did not exist in any separate state after this life: for so Josephus <FONT SIZE="2" COLOR="#800000" FACE="Georgia" >(x)</FONT> says, that they deny the permanence of the soul, and rewards and punishments in the invisible state. And, according to the Talmudic <FONT SIZE="2" COLOR="#800000" FACE="Georgia" >(y)</FONT> writers, they denied that there was any other world than this: </div> <bR> <div> <B>but the Pharisees confess both</B>; the resurrection of the dead, and that there are spirits, both angels and the souls of men, which are immortal.  </div> <bR> <div>  <FONT SIZE="1" COLOR="#000000" FACE="Georgia" ><I>John Gill's Exposition of the Entire Bible - Dr. John Gill (1690-1771)</I></FONT></div> <bR> <bR> <bR> <div> <FONT SIZE="3" COLOR="#000000" FACE="Arial" >For more on this topic, go to "Mark Finley on </FONT><A HREF="id170.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="State of Dead Mark Finley"><U>State of the Dead</U></A>"</div> <div> Comprehesive study on <FONT SIZE="3" COLOR="#000099" FACE="Arial" ><A HREF="id238.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Where are the Dead?"><U>Where are the dead</U></A></FONT>!</div> <div> Return to Study on <A HREF="id56.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="JW doctrines"><U>JW Doctrines</U></A></div> <bR> <div> <A HREF="id226.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Armageddon"><U>Armageddon</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id223.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Blood"><U>Blood</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id212.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Cross"><U>Cross</U></A>   |   <B>Death</B>   |   <A HREF="id224.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Earth "><U>Earth </U></A>   |   <A HREF="id225.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Heaven"><U>Heaven</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id222.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Interfaith"><U>Interfaith</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id214.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Jehovah God"><U>Jehovah God</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id219.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Jehovahs Witness"><U>Jehovah's Witness</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id220.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Lords Meal"><U>Lord's Meal</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id221.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Return of Christ"><U>Return of Christ</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id216.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Salvation"><U>Salvation</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id217.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Eternal Life"><U>Eternal Life</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id218.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Trinity"><U>Trinity</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id237.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="John 1:1 What do scholars say?"><U>John 1:1  What do scholars say?</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id238.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Where are the Dead?"><U>Where are the Dead?</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id245.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Wisdom"><U>Wisdom</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id254.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Former J.Ws."><U>Former J.W's.</U></A>   |   <A HREF="id293.htm" TARGET="_top" TITLE="Subliminal Images"><U>Subliminal Images</U></A> </div> <bR> <bR> </td> </tr></table></body>